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Weightshift to three-axis - what is the rule?

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  • #16
    Weightshift to three-axis - what is the rule?

    This is sort of related to the above! I have a CAA PPL (SEP) & (TMG) ,(single engine piston and touring motor glider); can I fly three axis microlights in the UK or do I need another licence/difference training? If I cross this hurdle can I then fly three-axis microlights in France/Europe?

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    • #17
      Weightshift to three-axis - what is the rule?

      Hi Dave,

      Yes and yes.

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      • #18
        Weightshift to three-axis - what is the rule?

        Learning a motor skill there are 4 stages to go through.

        1. Unconscious Incompetence. (you don't know you are incompetent because you don't understand what is involved)
        2. Consciously Incompetent(as you start to learn you realise how Incompetent you are)
        3. Consciously Competent (as you learn further you become competent but have to think about what you are doing)
        4. Unconsciously Competent (you become proficient at the skill and do it without thinking about it)

        So, please don't fly 3 axis until you have reached the 4th stage, automatically doing the opposite control could be fatal.

        Try this at the airfield sometime if you want to prove it to yourself (only at the airfield and at the start of the runway not on a street)

        Swap your feet over on the car and try to drive it, then slow down and stop. Once you have you will really realise how important it is to become unconsciously Competent at the opposite controls.

        ONLY TRY THE ABOVE WHERE YOU HAVE LOADS AND LOADS OF ROOM LIKE THE AIRFIELD AND WHERE THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO POSSIBILITY OF CRASHING INTO ANYTHING.

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        • #19
          Weightshift to three-axis - what is the rule?

          I converted last year and spent the first couple of hours in my old Rans just taxying up and down the runway, figures of eight etc until i got used to the "incorrect" pedal inputs. It does get easier. Using the stick was fairly straight forward, no real problems there.
          BUT as a NPPL (M) you DO need to be signed off by a 3-axis instructor. My instructor went through the full 3-axis syllabus plus things like side-slipping, fish tailing etc then a quick solo excursion round the circuit at Barton and then DONE !
          I understand that with the old PPL licence you can just hop from one to the other......but you'd be a proper plonker if you did without any form of training. You might as well let Stevie Wonder shave your goolies with a cut-throat razor !!!!
          Ade

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          • #20
            Weightshift to three-axis - what is the rule?

            PMSL Adrien!!

            That last comment cheered up my otherwise dull day.. Thank you :tongue:

            Happy Christmas...

            Nick.

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            • #21
              Weightshift to three-axis - what is the rule?

              Adrien Kentzer (6333) said...(MUCH CLIPPED)
              I understand that with the old PPL licence you can just hop from one to the other......but you'd be a proper plonker if you did without any form of training. You might as well let Stevie Wonder shave your goolies with a cut-throat razor !!!!
              Ade
              Peter says...... I personally am surprised that this has never been looked at by the CAA/BMAA and ruled as being f##king stupid and the regulators haven't blocked it being allowed. I know in the air I don't have any trouble flying a flexwing, but I just always have the niggling thought that I would pull the bar back on the flare !!!

              In all honesty I would rather take my chances with Stevie Wonder and his blade, than take my chances trying to land a Blade !!

              [/quote]

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              • #22
                Weightshift to three-axis - what is the rule?

                The ANO amendment of 2008 includes a requirement for pilots with only flexwing experience wanting to fly fixed wing to undertake and complete differences training with an instructor qualified to instruct on the fixed wing microlights and also the otherway around Fixed to flex. It applies to all licenses in which the microlight class rating is included.
                The extract from the ANO reads:
                Section 2 Aircraft and instructor ratings which may be included in United Kingdom
                Licences, JAR-FCL Licences and National Private Pilot's Licences (Aeroplanes)
                (b) Where:
                (i) the aeroplane has 3 axis controls and his previous training and experience
                has only been in an aeroplane with flexwing/weightshift controls;
                (ii) the aeroplane has flexwing/weightshift controls and his previous training
                and experience has only been in an aeroplane with 3 axis controls; or
                (iii) the aeroplane has more than one engine,
                before he exercises the privileges of the rating, appropriate differences training,
                given by a flight instructor entitled to instruct on the aeroplane on which
                instruction is being given, must have been completed, recorded in his personal
                flying logbook, and endorsed

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                • #23
                  Weightshift to three-axis - what is the rule?

                  geoff Weighell wrote:
                  The ANO amendment of 2008 includes a requirement for pilots with only flexwing experience wanting to fly fixed wing to undertake and complete differences training with an instructor qualified to instruct on the fixed wing microlights and also the otherway around Fixed to flex. It applies to all licenses in which the microlight class rating is included.
                  The extract from the ANO reads:
                  Section 2 Aircraft and instructor ratings which may be included in United Kingdom
                  Licences, JAR-FCL Licences and National Private Pilot's Licences (Aeroplanes)
                  (b) Where:
                  (i) the aeroplane has 3 axis controls and his previous training and experience
                  has only been in an aeroplane with flexwing/weightshift controls;
                  (ii) the aeroplane has flexwing/weightshift controls and his previous training
                  and experience has only been in an aeroplane with 3 axis controls; or
                  (iii) the aeroplane has more than one engine,
                  before he exercises the privileges of the rating, appropriate differences training,
                  given by a flight instructor entitled to instruct on the aeroplane on which
                  instruction is being given, must have been completed, recorded in his personal
                  flying logbook, and endorsedPeter asks.......Does the ANO amendment of 2008 mean that anyone who previously exercised privileges flying flexwing and prior to 2008 changed over to 3 axis now needs to complete differences training if they didn't get formal training previously Does someone who has moved from PPL(A) to flying only microlights need to complete difference training or for that matter does any pilot who chooses to fly 3 axis microlights as part of their PPL(A) need to get the microlight class rating ?

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                  • #24
                    Weightshift to three-axis - what is the rule?

                    Interesting thread. Here is another confusion then. I have a Group A licence with Nil restrictions against microlights (as well as self launching motor gliders etc) it doesn't say though if that refers to flex or 3 axis. ??

                    Ehm

                    I do now, and have flown both flex and fixed wing and I have in 12 years or so of flying gone through several changes on my licence where i had privileges to fly microlights on my group A licence, then i wasn't allowed so had a separate microlight licence, then it all changed back again.

                    It doesn't say on my licence if i can fly flex or 3 axis. (I have been flying both for years though)

                    In response to one of the post above you do right taxying around doing figure 8s. I try and get a good mix of GA/Flex so i dont get too used to one or the other. To me flying controls are very natual but I do have to think about the feet!!

                    Regards
                    Kev

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